I guess I'm a little slow on this one. Who, in your opinion is the offending player, the one that asked what the other player had in his hand, or the player that answered him? I need to know who you are going to penalize. I would also like to know where in the TDA rules this is covered.
Would you look at Matt's response for me please, because what I see is Matt talking about Buchman's hand not being dead but he should get a penalty.
Why don't we just come out with a rule that players can not speak about their hand (truth or not) and they can't ask opponents about their holding. I will wait for your answers on the questions above.
Okay, Nick.
I don't know how someone who has been teaching dealers since I was an infant (are you sure about that?) can still not understand the concepts at hand.
To my knowledge, players can never be penalized for asking any question when a hand is being played by two players. But telling another player what cards you hold is against the rules in a tournament, regardless of the number of players in the hand.
You have made reference to Matt's response to my question, but you have never quoted it in any of your posts. I contacted Matt directly and asked:
Hey Matt.
I'd like your opinion about the following hand:
After one player pushed all in, he asked the other player if he held an ace. While considering a call, the other player said that he did hold an ace, possibly/probably attempting to get a reaction from the other player.
TDA rules state:
41. No Disclosure
Players are obligated to protect the other players in the tournament at all times. Therefore, players, whether in the hand or not, may not:
1. Disclose contents of live or folded hands,
2. Advise or criticize play at any time,
3. Read a hand that hasn't been tabled.
The one-player-to-a-hand rule will be enforced.
One perspective is that the player who disclosed that he held an ace was just making common table chatter. Another viewpoint is that disclosing one's holdings, or showing one's cards when the action is incomplete violates the rules.
What do you think?
Matt's response to me was:
Well he definitely broke the rule and would not have a dead hand but should be subjected to a one round penalty.
My original question, and the question to Matt, was about the player who disclosed that he held an ace.
It seems that you've been wrongly focusing on the last line in rule 41:
"The one-player-to-a-hand rule will be enforced."
But the only reason that this line has been included in my posts is because it is part of the rule. The applicable concepts of rule 41, in this scenario, are the parts that relate to disclosing one's holdings.
As someone who has been teaching dealers for twenty, thirty, forty, fifty, or sixty years (based on your guess of my age compared to your age), you should know that you should be looking at all aspects of a situation and use all of your knowledge and experience to make a decision, and not jump to conclusions. As far as your credentials, Nick, you may have been teaching dealers for most of your life. But that doesn't mean that you know what you're doing.
I have never meant to insult you. My goal has been to encourage you to think about the concepts that have been discussed, and to review the TDA rules and to gain an objective understanding of what they mean. I'm not perfect, and I don't know everything. But I'm done in this thread because, at this point, if the concepts and TDA rules are still not understood, there's nothing that I can say to make it happen.
When I posed the original question in this thread, and to Matt directly, I knew what the correct answer was. I was merely interested in seeing the responses that the question would produce.
