Author Topic: call/undercall  (Read 615 times)

Ash

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call/undercall
« on: December 29, 2019, 07:52:16 PM »
Hi all

Post flop
A bets 2600, B raises 5600, C didn't see the raise, throws one single 5k chip without saying anything (willing to call the 2600 bet)
How to rule that?

tommarsden

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Re: call/undercall
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2019, 09:49:59 PM »
5K is committed can decide whether or not to call the full 5600.

Dave Miller

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Re: call/undercall
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2019, 06:58:06 AM »
I would rule that player C can fold and forfeit 2600 or call 5600, but not raise.
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown.
But how much does it cost to knock on wood?

MikeB

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Re: call/undercall
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2019, 02:32:08 PM »
TDA Rule 51-B applies here. Since C is not facing the opening bet, at TDs discretion C may be allowed to "forfeit the amount of the intended undercall and fold". The intended undercall is 2600 here. Note it's TDs discretion whether to allow the fold or to require a full call.

Regarding the amount that C would forfeit if allowed, should it be 2600 or 5000? This question was discussed at the 2019 Summit. The Board members were somewhat split in initial discussion but on the floor the "intended undercall" was adopted.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2019, 02:33:58 PM by MikeB »

Nick C

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Re: call/undercall
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2019, 05:53:46 PM »
I'm sorry. I know how the rule reads but it is stated that Player C did not see the raise. As long as substantial action has not followed Player C, I would allow him the options to withdraw the errant bet and fold or call. I have always been against giving any tournament player chips they should not have. Forcing a player to surrender more chips than he or she intended makes no sense to me. Why would any player intentionally do what Player C did? I may be missing an angle-shoot here...enlighten me, please.

Ash

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Re: call/undercall
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2019, 08:06:37 PM »
So according to what MikeB says, if I'm right, the player would commited for the 2600 bet? (and then could fold and lose the chips or call the 5600)

Nick C

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Re: call/undercall
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2020, 02:12:11 AM »
Yes, Ash...That is what Mike said and that is how the rule is written. Surrender 2600 or call 5600.