Author Topic: Showing cards with action pending.  (Read 6858 times)

Tristan

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Showing cards with action pending.
« on: September 02, 2013, 06:09:29 PM »
A player, facing an all-in, exposes his hand to get a read.  I let the hand continue to completion and then I give them a penalty.  (Standard call)

Let me ask you this...what do you do if his exposure makes the other player think he called and they flip their hand as well? 

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Nick C

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2013, 07:11:11 PM »
Interesting...I will assume the action is head to head because the call would be different with multiple players.

Head to head; I would place all blame on the all-in that prematurely flipped his cards. Pay attention.

Martin Roy TD

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2013, 06:18:02 AM »
Do you always give a Penalty or warning ?

In the case that a player shows his hand to have a read and the other player sho ws his hand thinking he's called, too bad the players have to follow
the game. In that case, it will be a penalty for sure.

Talking about Penalty ? What kind of penalty you will give ?

Nick C

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2013, 06:44:56 AM »
Martin,

 The penalty would depend on the player involved, (based on history, experience, reputation, etc., etc.). Others may not agree with me but, there is a difference when action is heads up, and when there are multiple players. Exposing your hand when facing one player might be a tactical move to try to get a read, or reaction from your opponent. However, showing your hand, with action pending, against multiple players is a more serious violation of poker etiquette and warrants a stricter punishment.

 I believe there are others that can give you a better range of punishment, than I.

Tristan

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #4 on: September 04, 2013, 10:04:17 AM »
I usually give a 1 orbit penalty for showing cards to get a read.  It is pretty blatant and players know they shouldn't do it. 
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K-Lo

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #5 on: September 04, 2013, 12:38:31 PM »
I usually give a 1 orbit penalty for showing cards to get a read.  It is pretty blatant and players know they shouldn't do it. 

The all-in player thought he was called, but the fact is that he wasn't called.  So what can you do?  Action to the player who has yet to act, complete the hand.  Minimum 1 round penalty as noted by Tristan -- definitely escalating for multiple offences.

WSOPMcGee

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #6 on: September 25, 2013, 02:43:31 AM »
What K-Lo said.

I've actually seen this many times both as TD and player. On more than a couple of occasions I've even seen the TD rule that the player who exposed their cards thinking they were called and quickly turned the cards back over, made that player turn the cards back over so the player facing action could see what they missed the first time! I just shake my head in disbelief.  ???

I mean really. That actually has happened. TWICE!
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Tristan

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #7 on: September 25, 2013, 11:26:31 AM »
Wow
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WSOPMcGee

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2013, 04:49:05 PM »
Which actually brings up an interesting question.

Assume 3 way action.

Player A (seat 9) bets, Player B (seat 1) has done nothing, Player C (seat 8) says call out of turn. Player A sees Player C call and turns their hand over. Player B says I haven't called yet. Player A realizes this and turns their cards back over. Player B has not seen Player A's hand. But Player C has. Now what? LOL
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Nick C

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2013, 09:20:42 PM »
Thomas,

 Player's must act in turn and protect their own hand. Therefore, the player's that did not follow the rules are screwed! It's not much different than a player accidentally dropping his cards...(yes I said his). The game continues.

 I have to say that your use of "their" does not read well. His would be much better. ;)

WSOPMcGee

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2013, 12:53:31 AM »
I have to say that your use of "their" does not read well. His would be much better. ;)

We could use "guys" since that is neutral. Or maybe "Youz guys" or "Ya'll" or maybe "Yo" as Chets article alluded to as the trend. But until then, if a Player turns over their cards, they are still their cards that they have to protect.  ;D
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Nick C

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #11 on: September 27, 2013, 07:26:56 AM »
Thomas,

 I agree...but your use of "their" in the reply that you just posted is incorrect: Your quote: "Player A sees Player C call and turns their hand over. Player B says I haven't called yet. Player A realizes this and turns their cards back over." Read it out loud and tell me what sounds better..."their" or "his." How about a rewrite: As soon as Player C's hand is exposed, Player A's hand is also exposed. There are numerous ways to describe just about any situation. It's too bad that using "he" or "his" bothers you so much...it really makes writing much easier.

 I always thought youz had an "e" on the end! ;D
« Last Edit: September 27, 2013, 07:30:14 AM by Nick C »

WSOPMcGee

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #12 on: September 27, 2013, 01:09:22 PM »
Thomas,

 I agree...but your use of "their" in the reply that you just posted is incorrect: Your quote: "Player A sees Player C call and turns their hand over. Player B says I haven't called yet. Player A realizes this and turns their cards back over." Read it out loud and tell me what sounds better..."their" or "his." How about a rewrite: As soon as Player C's hand is exposed, Player A's hand is also exposed. There are numerous ways to describe just about any situation. It's too bad that using "he" or "his" bothers you so much...it really makes writing much easier.

 I always thought youz had an "e" on the end! ;D
I read it and I understand what you mean. Did the player expose their own cards or the other players cards. I get it. But I just that the use of the word referred directly to the noun that is in action used prior to its use (even that is hard to read).  In this case Player A is in action. Player A sees.

Anyway I don't know how I became a nit to try and be grammatically correct. I hated English class. I just like to include and not exclude groups when it comes to official literature. Our gender identity in the U.S. is so screwed up you can say one thing that is total correct towards one group and completely offend another group. We have to try and word documents that include groups that are more than just men and women. There is no word that includes all groups and that offends none. It's stupid. So Mike B is probably correct. A little disclaimer blurb and make every player a "HE".
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Nick C

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Re: Showing cards with action pending.
« Reply #13 on: September 27, 2013, 07:36:25 PM »
Thomas,

 You're not alone, and no one can really say you're wrong. That's one of the problems with the English language. Imagine how some of our poker friends around the world feel when they try to translate?

 Anyway, I meant what I said earlier about your R.O.P.E. It is really well written. The use of the singular noun "he" is seldom used, and probably the better choice of words, when it is used.

 Don't feel so bad, I'm not much of an English major, either. If it wasn't for "spell check" I'd be in serious trouble.  ;D

 Thanks for briefly taking the conversation away from poker...now, let's get back to fixing some of these messed-up rules! 8)