Author Topic: Redrawing for button  (Read 15566 times)


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Redrawing for button
« on: July 28, 2011, 08:33:56 PM »
Does anyone else think that it is unnecessary when you redraw seats to redraw for the button as well? On a final table everyone redraws seats. Doesn't that randomize enough to not have to draw for button as well? It just seems a little redundant to me to be doing both. If anyone has reasoning for doing both I'd love to hear it.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2011, 06:46:53 PM by Spence »

Brian Vickers

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Re: Redrawing for button
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2011, 07:18:24 AM »
We always used to start our button in the 10 seat at every table, and then did the draw for seating, figuring it was random so the button random draw was already taken care of. 
We have since changed to the two draw system, draw for seats then button.  One of the reasons we changed was because of the number of players we were getting with vision impairment that we ended up having to have draw from the 1-5-6-10 seats so that they could get a seat where they could see (still random, just from a limited drawing pool).  We're talking a lot of seniors playing our tournaments, so often I'd have to make arrangements for 2-3 or more players at the final table (which was usually manageable.  Drawing for the button again took care of the worry of another player not having the possibility of drawing the button simply because they had better vision. 
The other reason is that it eliminates the chance a T.D. would shuffle the seat cards and set up the seat 10 for a short stack buddy, eliminates that possibility since the button draw is from a fresh, cut deck.  Same reason we always pick the next big blind to move tables, eliminates any sort of T.D. influence if the procedure is always the same.

Stuart Murray

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Re: Redrawing for button
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2011, 05:06:27 PM »
I thought there was a rule in RROP which stated specifically that the seating draw must be seperate from the button draw, but I cannot find it.  I did find these rules though that more or less say the same thing, in TOURNAMENTS:

2. Initial seating is determined by random draw or assignment. (For a one-table satellite event, cards to determine seating may be left faceup so the earlier entrants can pick their seat, since the button is assigned randomly.)

8. In all tournament games using a dealer button, the starting position of the button is determined by the players drawing for the high card.

We for the maority of Tournaments use the Seating Draw of the Tournament Software, followed by a high card for the button.  In Regional or National Tournaments we do a single draw for the button, which is then used throughout the Tournament for all redraws, for example where seat 4 is assigned, that is then used throughout the tournament on all tables, FIDPA rules:

In board playing / flop games, to determine the placement of the “dealer button” at the start of the tournament and after a re-draw of seats, cards will be dealt at a random single table, starting in seat 1. A single card will be dealt for each seat at the table. The high card dealt by “suit ranking” will determine the dealer button’s position. The awarded position of “dealer button” will then be used at all tournament tables.