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Stud Ante & Short Stub procedure Draw games


Howdy all,

Just wanted to provide some details of what I have implemented for our HEROS (and other rotations) as well as Draw games in 2024.

Stud Ante system

1. We have implemented a "Stud ante" single payer system similar to that of a BBA in NLH/PLO etc

2. When changing from a blinds game to a Stud game, the dealer places the "Stud ante" card with the player who WOULD have been Big Blind if this were a blinds game.

3. The dealer button is not frozen - it is taken by the dealer.

4. When returning to a blinds game. The player who last paid the "Stud Ante" becomes the small blind - the player who would have paid the ante next is to pay the small blind. Dealer button is placed accordingly.

5. When moving players for balancing purposes - you are able to use the 'UTG' system whether its blinds or Stud by taking the next Big blind or next Stud ante player.

6. It doesn't matter who is eliminated, the button is simply placed behind the last player who paid the Stud ante.

The system took a little while for the Dinosaurs to understand, it definitely speeds up the game without the need for dealers to take extra time to count antes, give change etc - they can keep pitching. We have a system for the amount of the ante, similar to BBA it is encouraged not to reduce for the duration of the tournament. I have on occasions exercised my discretion to reduce to half when the tournament is four handed (not FT bubble), when only four players remain. This is dependant on the structure and buy-in.

SHORT STUB - Draw games

Those that play Lowball variants (especially Badeucey and Badacey) will relate.

You get to the third draw, discards are in front of players, let's say you need 7 cards total to replace. There are only 4 cards left in the stub.

What does everyone else do?

I have adopted a similar system to the TDA recommendations on Stud when going to 7th street and the stub is short.

In the example above, 7 cards are required + 2 = 9 cards total (burn, discards and 1 card left on bottom of stub). So in this scenario, I would place the remaining stub with the previous burns and discards and create a new stub (leaving the two burn cards in tact) - then burn and replace the 7 discards for live players.

Conversely, if, the discards totalled 4 only then I would need 4 + 2 = 6 cards ... I would use the short stub of four cards, scrambled/shuffled and cut with the 2 burn cards (Total 6 unseen cards) to make a new stub. Burn, replace discards.

There has been a lot of discussion around this particular procedure, and I know it isn't covered by TDA. I have gathered info from other operators and they do various things such as:

1. Shuffle everything together including burns.
2. Pitch/replace what's in the stub first then shuffle and replace the rest
3. Only use cards from initial deal and first discards (not second discard pile)

My theory when developing this was to find a solution that covers the following:

1. A fair distribution of unseen cards for live players discards on last draw
2. A fair and equitable chance at unseen cards so that all players are in the same position. By this I mean that OOP players should not have an advantage over other players simply because they called from the blinds and now receive unseen cards where the later positioned players will now receive previous mucked cards and discards.
3. Only shuffling initial mucks and discards is also not considered to be in keeping with 'fairness' of the game - making sure each player has the same opportunity as the next.

Enough rambling from me, If there are any other Mixed game peoples/nerds out there I'd love to hear from you as to what you are doing in today's game.


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