Balancing tables: are more specific guidelines needed?

[deagian]

hello.
i have a question about the balancing of the tables.
if there are 3 tables one with 8 players one with 8 players and one with 6 players i have to balance 8 7 and 7?
and from which  table i have to move a player?
or with minus 2 players as tda rules i don't have to move any player?
thanks

[Brian Vickers]

Two part answer:
You don't have to move a player, but you should. 
Tables have to remain within 2, but if you aren't proactive then you will run into situations where you have to hold up players while you do lose that 3rd player.  If you keep the tables within 1, then when you lose another player you can move a player over at a normal pace instead of panic mode

[Nick C]

I agree with Brian...8-7-7 is better than 8-8-6. As far as which table to move the player from...I'd take from the first available. Sometimes, these games diminish quickly and you find yourself bringing a player back to the table you just removed one from.

[WSOPMcGee]

If you want to run a professional tournament, then when you have 3 tables remaining and you have Table 1 with 8 players and Table 2 with 8 players and Table 3 with 6 players then you will be move players not "because you should" but because you are required to balance tables within 1 player (not 2) with less than 54 players in the tournament.

Which table do you move from?

Assuming your established breaking order is Highest table to Lowest table, then you would move a player from Table 2 to Table 3. If it's Lowest to Highest, then you move a player from Table 1 to Table 3.

[Nick C]

Thomas...I think we agree, don't we?

[WSOPMcGee]

Thomas...I think we agree, don't we?

Not completely. Brian said

You don't have to move a player, but you should.

You agreed.

I disagree. You have to move a player. You must balance within 1 at that point in a tournament.

[Nick C]

Okay Thomas, understood. We reached the same conclusion, but your ruling is more appropriate and actually what I've been preaching for in all of our rules...a firm strict application.

[BillM16]

... you are required to balance tables within 1 player (not 2) with less than 54 players in the tournament.

Can you provide a link to the reference?  I'm having a hard time finding this in writing. Thanks.

[BillM16]

... you are required to balance tables within 1 player (not 2) with less than 54 players in the tournament.

Can you provide a link to the reference?  I'm having a hard time finding this in writing. Thanks.

Is this simply common practice or a well documented procedure?

[mikeyp22]

Since there is nothing about it in the TDA I always reference roberts rules for this one, where it states four tables or more are balanced within 2 players, but once it drops below that you must balance within one... or at least i think that was roberts rules...

[chet]

From RROP Ver. 11 -

16.  The number of players at each table will be kept reasonably balanced by the transfer of a player as needed. With more than six tables, table size will be kept within two players. With six tables or less, table size will be kept within one player.

Chet

[K-Lo]

The WSOP policy this year is:

When 12 or less tables remain in a tournament, play will hold when there are " TWO " or more seats available.

[BillM16]

Perhaps a discussion during the 2015 Summit would be worthwhile?

[MikeB]

Perhaps a discussion during the 2015 Summit would be worthwhile?

Definitely will be on the agenda.

[WSOPMcGee]

The WSOP policy this year is:

When 12 or less tables remain in a tournament, play will hold when there are " TWO " or more seats available.

WSOP policy has been that for a number of years. But only in specific instances. 12 tables is brought into play with more than X number of players in the field. Used to be a field greater than 1,000 was our guideline,  now it's just greater than 20 tables. The rules don't specifically cover field size except for how we balance if there are more than 20 tables remaining in the field. The general rule of thumb used in most tournaments is how many tables get paid? Don't use the WSOP as your basis for this. Our fields generally range in the 40 to 400+ table range. Quite significantly larger than your normal 6 to 10 table tournament at you local casino. If you do use the WSOP for your standard you will find that you will be moving players almost for no purpose and will run yourself ragged moving players that probably don't need to be moved.

Also consider the staffing ability that we have compared to others. It's a lot easier to manage 108 players balancing within 1 with 2+ staff members then it is if you're by yourself. 12 tables is not a lot of ground to cover, but it is a problem when your in the money and play is fast and players are busting fairly frequently. That doesn't leave much time if your trying to payout players, balance tables and break tables at the same time.

So 12 tables is not for everyone.

Also this used to be when we usually go to 9 handed play. We generally don't always have the space. Nowadays we can go 9 handed on day 2's most of the time.