Thanks for the excellent responses! And thanks to the EXCELLENT dealer who handled the situation correctly and allowed the chop! And thanks, Mike, for qualifying the subject title with Showdown!
Your responses triggered a few followups!
1-Thanks Stuart! (And thanks for your Olympics coverage!) I think that I would qualify your answer by saying you CAN fold at showdown if it's not an all-in situation. In my case the player apparantly had not folded as the player had not declared fold, there was no action pending, and the cards had not hit the muck! However, I think the player is entitled to FOLD (if not all-in) because of the options allowed in Rules 12 and 14 below: (Note: the only verbage that may negate this thought is that Rule 14 specifies that the lass aggressive player MUST show first! - maybe implying that he cannot fold!, but why even have the rule separate from rule 10 if all players mus show! Maybe the rule could use some cleanup!)
12: Showdown Order
In a non-all-in showdown, at the end of the last round of betting, the player who made the last aggressive action in that betting round must show first. If there was no bet in the last round, the player to the left of the button shows first and so on clockwise. In stud, the player with the high board must show first. In razz, the lowest board shows first.
14: Asking to See a Hand. Except where house policy requires a hand to be shown or provides an express right to see a hand on request, asking to see a hand is a privilege granted at TD’s discretion to protect the integrity of the game (suspicion of invalid hand, collusion, etc). This privilege is not to be abused. A player who mucks his hand face down at showdown without fully tabling it loses any rights he may have to ask t tto see any hand.
2) If the player does not retrieve the cards, I then presume the dealer should kill the hand.
3) If a player does not retrieve the hand and another player requests to see it before the dealer mucks it, and the TD obliges (Rule 14), is the hand still live? By the way, this could be very relevant in a tournament jackpot situation!
4) In what situation can the dealer retrieve and open up a "mucked" hand (without the player physically turning it over)? I think I had one dealer tell me that he could never turn a player's cards over. I'm thinking he can of course turn it over upon player request when the TD obliges (Rule 14), also in an all-in situation, and maybe in the first situation that I described. However, I tempted to say that the dealer should kill the hand if the cards are face down, not in the muck, and no player asks to see them!
5) Mike mentioned that before the showdown, this would be a binding fold. I think I agree and want to make sure that you agree that the player then cannot retrieve his hand. I know however, that in some cases, players and dealers are lenient with players that fold facing a check, or if in the big blind with no raise, or if in the blind and don't know they're in the blind!
Thanks,
Steven