Author Topic: boxed card on the flop  (Read 3243 times)

alex

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boxed card on the flop
« on: August 05, 2010, 05:58:49 PM »

HI ALL.
There is a 5/10 NLH cash game. The dealer discards the burn card & put down the flop just to find out that the 3rd card is face up in the deck .
            should the boxed card be mucked & replaced by the next card wich is the turn burn card.
            or the boxed card will stay & be used as a burn card on the turn , so the turn & river card will stay the same.

           does the same rule apply in a tournament game. TY
« Last Edit: August 05, 2010, 06:17:07 PM by alex »

Nick C

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Re: boxed card on the flop
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2010, 07:55:15 PM »
The boxed card is like a "joker" in a game that does not use a joker. Therefore it will be replaced by the card beneath it. You asked if it would be replaced by the turn card......that could be confusing. Keep in mind, what you are refering to as the turn card, really isn't the proper turn card because the boxed card is a "blank." As far as I know, a boxed card is treated the same in cash games as it is in a tournament. You can add this to the rules governing boxed cards: if more than one boxed card is discovered in the deal (not the deck stub), it is a misdeal.

Stuart Murray

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Re: boxed card on the flop
« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2010, 03:19:42 AM »
Hi Alex,

Nick is correct in his interpretation, Robert's Rules of Poker (RROP) rule attached:

7. A card discovered faceup in the deck (boxed card) will be treated as a meaningless scrap of paper. A card being treated as a scrap of paper will be replaced by the next card below it in the deck, except when the next card has already been dealt facedown to another player and mixed in with other downcards. In that case, the card that was faceup in the deck will be replaced after all other cards are dealt for that round.

This rule is the same in Ring/Tournament.  To use the 'Turn Crad' would be incorrect, you are still issuing the flop as normal, the boxed card has no bearing on the stub, it is (treated as) a scrap of paper and you would then burn and turn for 4th street as normal.

Regards
Stuart
Stuart Murray
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alex

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Re: boxed card on the flop
« Reply #3 on: August 06, 2010, 08:26:19 PM »
 hi all & ty for replaying.there is a bit misundertanding in here.
 i meant  that the boxed card should be replaced by the next card below it ,wich is the the card that would be burned before openning the turn
 ( so its not the card on the turn). but if we do that then the real card on the turn & the river would not be the same as they should be.

 then is it better that we use the boxed card that is found on the flop as a burn card on the turn so we keep the card on the turn & the river same as they should be .
(If you swap the boxed card with the next burn card then 4 out of 5  cards on the board are still correct). hope i made myself clear ... ty
« Last Edit: August 06, 2010, 09:19:43 PM by alex »

Stuart Murray

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Re: boxed card on the flop
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2010, 06:06:42 AM »
Hi there,

no you never treat the boxed card as a card that would of played - it is meaninless, under RROP the board is unchanged as the boxed card doesn't really exist (It's a kind of does exist card but doesn't play as part of the deck during the hand)

You would burn and turn as normal, ignoring the boxed card.
then is it better that we use the boxed card that is found on the flop as a burn card on the turn so we keep the card on the turn & the river same as they should be .
(If you swap the boxed card with the next burn card then 4 out of 5  cards on the board are still correct).
No - a card is burned before each street to reduce the possibility of someone seeing into the stub - i.e. seeing the next card, so in this instance you must still burn

Hope that helps!

Stu
« Last Edit: August 07, 2010, 06:09:44 AM by Stuart Murray »
Stuart Murray
The Nuts Poker League
South Scotland &
National Tournament Director