POKER TOURNAMENT RULES QUESTIONS & DISCUSSIONS > Discussion of Rules by Specific Game Types

Running out of cards in a Stud deal and other Stud irregularities

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K-Lo:

--- Quote from: Nick C on April 15, 2015, 09:14:59 PM --- As far as worrying about the burncards being unseen, I guess we have to teach the dealers the importance of keeping the burn, clean and separate from the muck...especially in stud.

--- End quote ---

And dealing the burn cards with the deck close to the table so the burn card is not accidentally seen (as opposed to e.g. lifting the burn card high off the deck and flashing it to one side of the table).

Nick C:
Ken:

 No doubt about it. You have to count the community card.

 I remember telling a player that he was the high hand with his ace, (no pair board) and another player had a flush with the community card! I'm always looking back to the rules from long ago, but sometimes I don't agree with them either! ;D What were they thinking? When dealing a low limit stud game, dealers are to announce "possible" straights and "flushes" on sixth street. So how do you not announce a five-flush on the river when a community card is part of the hand?

 As far as the burncards: Yes, they must be "clean" (unseen). Did you know; a prematurely dealt card could cause an entire round to be buried? And, they are placed with the burncards for a later round if necessary? 

 While were at it...keep the damn burncards away from the muck! ::)

K-Lo:

--- Quote from: Nick C on April 16, 2015, 07:06:28 AM --- No doubt about it. You have to count the community card.

--- End quote ---

I agree with this.


--- Quote from: Nick C on April 16, 2015, 07:06:28 AM ---When dealing a low limit stud game, dealers are to announce "possible" straights and "flushes" on sixth street. So how do you not announce a five-flush on the river when a community card is part of the hand?

--- End quote ---

True.  This isn't done/encouraged anymore.



--- Quote from: Nick C on April 16, 2015, 07:06:28 AM ---As far as the burncards: Yes, they must be "clean" (unseen). Did you know; a prematurely dealt card could cause an entire round to be buried? And, they are placed with the burncards for a later round if necessary? 

--- End quote ---

Yes, an entire round of cards will be taken out of play if cards for a subsequent street are dealt prematurely.  The unexposed ones are set aside to be used later if a reshuffle is required. 

However, this is another aspect of the traditional way of dealing with reshuffles that I'd like a proposed simplification to address. I'd like to see that we (1) never re-use burn cards even if they are supposed to be "clean" (since they have been out of control of the dealer or players and have a high chance of being inadvertently flashed, IMO), and (2) don't bother reshuffling anymore, just use a community card whenever there are not enough cards from the remaining stub to be dealt.

Some might even argue that if a card is exposed prematurely, rather than removing all the cards of the whole round, we could simply complete the action, treat any exposed cards as scrap pieces of paper, and simply burn and deal out the cards for the next street without removing a whole round of cards. This was of course done traditionally so that each player would receive his "correct" card, albeit one street earlier, but it's all random anyway... a bit similar to that dropping of the deck example we recently discussed on a different thread.

Nick C:
Ken:

 Are you saying that announcing "possible" straights and flushes on sixth street is not encouraged anymore? I know it was not practiced in big bet poker, but certainly still used in low limit.

 I can't imagine dealers exposing any burncards on a regular basis. Exposing a card, any card, could have a serious affect on any game and is unacceptable.

 As far as your proposal for prematurely dealt cards: I believe the reason that it's done the traditional way is to allow the exposed card, or cards, a chance to be redealt. There is a big difference when a player sees, what should have been his "proper card" get taken from play, as opposed to being put aside with a chance that he could get it on a later round. Hopefully, the occurrence is rare and not a problem.

 Please don't make me go back and rewrite my dealer training text. :D

K-Lo:

--- Quote from: Nick C on April 17, 2015, 12:12:55 AM --- Are you saying that announcing "possible" straights and flushes on sixth street is not encouraged anymore? I know it was not practiced in big bet poker, but certainly still used in low limit.

--- End quote ---

Yes. This was common long ago, but rarely done anymore. Players have to read the boards. New pairs still announced.

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