PokerTDA

LIVE CASH GAME POKER RULES DISCUSSION => Live Cash Game Rules Questions => Topic started by: fgmyers on April 24, 2011, 01:50:35 AM

Title: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: fgmyers on April 24, 2011, 01:50:35 AM
Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Nick C on April 24, 2011, 05:19:49 AM
 I've never seen it. I know nothing about it. It's my guess that a cardroom that allows a Mississippi straddle, will allow anything if it's agreeable to the players and management. In order to buy the button, you are actually entering the hand in the SB position........can you straddle in the SB position? My guess is NO. I have no clue.
 I remember working at the Tropicana about 25 years ago. We started playing a game that a bunch of us used to play back home, and when the supervisor found out the next day we were warned that only games that were "on the books" with the Nevada Gaming Commission/Gaming Control Board could be played. There has to be a set of rules, to settle any dispute. I'm drifting off the subject a bit but, if you want to allow a straddle in that position, make sure everyone involved understands it. The good news is, you'll never see it in a tournament, or in my game.
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: chet on April 24, 2011, 07:59:40 AM
From Wikipedia:

Mississippi straddle

A Mississippi straddle is similar to a live straddle, but instead of being made by the player "under the gun", it can be made by any player, depending on house rules. House rules permitting Mississippi straddles are common in the southern United States. Like a live straddle, a Mississippi straddle must be at least the minimum raise. Action begins with the player to the left of the straddle. If, for example (in a game with $1025 blinds), the button puts a live $50 on it, the first player to act would be the small blind, followed by the big blind, and so on. If action gets back to the straddle with no raise, the straddle has the option of raising. The player to the left of a Mississippi straddle may re-straddle by placing a blind bet raising the original straddle.Mississippi straddle.

fgmyers:  As I interpret the above the answer is YES, PROVIDED your House Rules permit.

Basically the entire answer is "It depends on your House Rules".

chet
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Nick C on April 24, 2011, 04:08:00 PM
Chet,
 I agree with what you wrote but I'm not sure it covers the question about the player being allowed to straddle when buying the button. That would mean that the mississippi straddle would be from the SB position, and I don't know if that is covered, even in Wikipedia. I like your last sentence; "it depends on your house rules."
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Brian Vickers on April 24, 2011, 04:29:13 PM
Buying the button means you are buying "the rights" to the button.  In order to be the button in a game, you have to first post your blinds.  When you miss your big blind only and want to come back in the next hand you "buy the button" by posting the equivalent of one big blind as a live bet and one small blind as dead money.  You are then the only player who posts a big blind (all though other people can post from other positions if it is their first hand or if they also have missed blinds...) so IMO, no you can not straddle because you would be straddling your own big blind.  Since you can not Straddle from the big blind position, I do not see any reason to allow straddling on the same hand where you "buy the button". 
That being said, the next hand after you post you will be on the button, and if the casino allows button straddles, you may straddle since you have purchased the rights to the button on the previous hand.
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Spence on April 25, 2011, 09:56:11 PM
In my room if you miss a blind you are allowed to straddle your way into the game. If you do so you do not have to post the dead money. If we allowed a mississippi straddle then I don't see why you wouldn't be able to when posting your missed blind. Since buying the button is nearly the same as a missed blind(Posting both) then I don't see why not. It seems well within the boundaries if your posting rules allow. Again as per Chet "It depends on your House Rules"
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: W0lfster on April 10, 2013, 04:55:28 PM
Can the player left of the SB who bought the button posting both big blinds straddle after both blinds are posted in order to be the button next hand?
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: chet on April 10, 2013, 05:18:02 PM
Making a straddle bet has nothing to do with the placement of the button, zero, nada, zippo.  Therefore, in my opinion, the answer would be a resounding NO!
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: W0lfster on April 10, 2013, 05:28:19 PM
Sorry Chet did you understand my question? I mean say there is a seat vacant left of the button and a new player like myself comes along and posts both blinds to be the button next hand. On that very hand where I post both blinds and take the vacated seat can the player who is directly to my left who is relinquished of blind posting post an UTG straddle? If not why not?
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: chet on April 11, 2013, 01:27:49 PM
I guess I misunderstood your question.  But regardless, the answer is going to depend upon House Rules.  I am not aware of anything in RROP v11 that prevents such play, nor anything that specifically allows it either. 
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Nick C on April 13, 2013, 12:36:29 AM
W0lfster,

 If I understand your confusing question correctly, I would say any player, in any seat can Mississippi Straddle except the player that buy's the button. You do understand that in order to buy the button; you must enter the game and occupy the empty seat in the SB position; the immediate player seated to your left must have posted the BB on the previous hand.

 Last hand: 1 seat is the button, 2 seat is SB, 3 seat is empty, 4 seat is BB...Next hand, you enter the empty 3 seat...the button is the 2 seat and you may buy the button. The scenario that I've just explained would put the 4 seat player (UTG) in the perfect position to straddle.

 I know you'd rather hear from others but, when you ask questions about obscure situations that pertain to cash games, it's not going to happen...you're stuck with 5 or 6 of us that keep the Discussion Forum alive! Like it or not.
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: chet on April 13, 2013, 05:05:31 AM
Nick:  Not to disagree, but what do you do for both "Buy the Button" and "Mississippi Straddle" if there is nothing in the House Rules to either allow or deny?

Personally, I would deny if the House Rules do not specifically permit.  Isn't it kind of like "Check Raise", where most houses clarify it by having a House Rule allowing?

Chet
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Nick C on April 13, 2013, 06:35:02 AM
Chet,

 You are absolutely correct when you say it depends on house rules. If you go back to my first response on this thread, I said, "I've never heard of it." It's kind of like creating a "new game." If you can find enough agreeable player's. I did want to explain the possible scenario when a player "can" buy the button. You can't just sit in the small blind position and buy the button.

 So...W0lf, you can not Mississippi Straddle on the hand when you buy the button, you can only post the dead small and the big blind! That would (IMO) be the only answer that makes sense. :)

Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: W0lfster on April 15, 2013, 07:16:13 AM
Hi Nick and Chet, thanks again for your rapid responses also like the politeness of this forum. Anyway Nick Chet wasnt too sure about this I understand if you buy the be button you cannot straddle but my question was can the UTG straddle whether its regular or Mississippi when you have posted both blinds to buy the button? Basicly the person left of this player, now becomes the UTG can he then straddle if he wanted to in the same hand? So theres a button bought and straddle on the same hand. Thank you :)
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: chet on April 15, 2013, 07:51:32 AM
Wolfster:  I cannot say this any clearer, It depends on the House Rules.  As I said before, I was not able to find anything in RROP that either allows or denies a straddle bet in the same hand where there has been a "buy the button".

Chet
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Nick C on April 15, 2013, 08:10:17 PM
W0lfster,

 I thought I did answer your question. I say yes...(UTG) is the perfect position for a straddle. Why not? Chet is correct about house rules but, I can't imagine anyone that allows buying the button in a Mississippi Straddle game not allowing a straddle from anywhere!!!

 I've exhausted enough energy on this subject. I said on my very first reply that I've never seen it, and I'd never play the game... so my comments are not based on experience, just logic.
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Kendalizor on July 14, 2013, 05:03:23 PM
We allow similar to Mississippi straddles where I am. We allow straddling in any position except the blinds(Mississippi), though what we do different is allow any amount to be straddled(not Mississippi) unless it's a limit game of course. We DO NOT allow people to straddle when they buy the button because it tends to encourage the straddle to come in the game when someone is posting already. If someone posts in out of the blind they are allowed to straddle yet they still must post a dead small blind. I do like the straddles myself though because it promotes action in the game especially when people are playing tight. That is our straddling rules here and a few other places I've seen, but it's not very common to see these types of straddles that I've noticed.
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Spence on May 13, 2015, 11:58:38 AM
Kendalizor has the best response on this string.  We can all say it depends on house rules because this is a cash game post and we have no TDA rule about this so we're all just using logic or experience.  I say allow it to anyone who isn't a blind.  If you're buying the button then you're paying a blind so not there.  Otherwise, fill your boots!
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Nick C on May 13, 2015, 12:05:03 PM
Spence...It took you 2 years to respond? ??? I think most of us agreed, as long as the players understand and agree, do what you want.
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Spence on May 14, 2015, 09:32:56 AM
Hey I chimed in on the string before... and I've been gone for two years.  I've got a ton of catching up to do!
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Nick C on May 14, 2015, 10:11:28 AM
You were greatly missed...welcome back! :)
Title: Re: Can you button (Mississippi) straddle while buying the button?
Post by: Spence on May 14, 2015, 10:28:03 AM
I was very unfortunately away from poker for a little while (Job change) but I may be heading back into the fire.  I've missed you guys too.