PokerTDA

POKER TOURNAMENT RULES QUESTIONS & DISCUSSIONS => Discussion of Rules by Specific Game Types => Topic started by: Luca P. on December 20, 2016, 10:00:12 PM

Title: Player asked for pot, dealer gave wrong amount
Post by: Luca P. on December 20, 2016, 10:00:12 PM
Hi all, this happened in a £1/2 PLO cash game.
On the flop, playerA asked the dealer "how much is the pot?" then dealer promptly answered "£95". Then PlayerA put £95 in front of him. After this action, the dealer corrected himself and announced "sorry, pot is £120".
PlayerA now want to take his bet back (£95), floor was called on table.

I personally ruled this as:
PlayerA can take his bet back, and decides the action to take.

My decision was taken upon the fact that the player didnt say "I bet the pot, how much is it?", so he simply asked how much is the pot, and was given a wrong amount by a dealer that quickly corrected himself, with no substantial action occurred.
Title: Re: Player asked for pot, dealer gave wrong amount
Post by: Nick C on December 21, 2016, 03:40:21 PM
Luca P.

 I understand your logic and could agree with your decision, however...the TDA rules are quite clear in this situation.
 
TDA #49: Accepted Action Poker is a game of alert, continuous observation. It is the callerís responsibility to determine the correct
amount of an opponentís bet before calling, regardless of what is stated by others. If a caller requests a
count but receives incorrect information from a dealer or player, then pushes out that amount, the caller
has accepted the full correct action & is subject to the correct wager or all-in amount. As with all
situations, Rule 1 may apply at TDís discretion.

 I tend to lean more in your direction, but I would insist that the raiser is committed to at least his (£95).
Title: Re: Player asked for pot, dealer gave wrong amount
Post by: Uniden32 on December 22, 2016, 09:39:44 AM
Luca,

You decision was correct.  There was no action afterwards, I'm allowing the player to put in £120.

Nick,

Rule #49 is actually referring to callers and not bettors.
Title: Re: Player asked for pot, dealer gave wrong amount
Post by: Max D on December 22, 2016, 10:29:31 AM
Uniden  I agree with letting the player complete the bet to 120, not completely sure about letting him take the 95 back...
Title: Re: Player asked for pot, dealer gave wrong amount
Post by: Nick C on December 22, 2016, 11:18:19 AM
Ralph,

 You are correct about Rule 49 pertaining to the player that is calling, not betting. I still doubt that the TDA would support a complete withdrawal of the £95.

 The fact that Luca was referring to a cash game would offer more support to his decision. It can still get tricky when a player puts a specific amount in, and then withdraws it before substantial action occurs.

 I was wrong about TDA #49 but I'm sticking to a commitment on the £95. So I agree with Max...and really don't object too strongly against Luca's call, as long as another player was not mislead.
Title: Re: Player asked for pot, dealer gave wrong amount
Post by: Uniden32 on December 22, 2016, 01:01:05 PM
My apologies, I totally misinterpreted (misread) Luca's OP.

I'm not allowing the player to take back the £95. 

But, he can leave it at £95, or make it £120, nothing else.
Title: Re: Player asked for pot, dealer gave wrong amount
Post by: Boris Mauboussin on January 20, 2017, 10:19:47 AM
Hello folks,

I thought I had gave an answer on this case, but apparently not.

I agree with Nick,

Player can't take his 95£ back.
Since the player silently put 95£, the bet is valid.(he asked for the pot amount, he did not declare he wanted to bet the pot)
However, I would allow player to put 25£ more due to dealer wrong announcement.